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Title: Juliette - Marquis de Sade
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The Cuteness
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(Date Posted:03/11/2007 12:06:13)
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I am not recomending this bookWhat I want to know is - has anyone here read it? While browsing in Foyles bookshop I picked up a little book called "a short introduction to the Marquis de Sade" and read a bit about him. It said that Juliette was considered to be the most depraved book ever written. I thought, excellent, and headed off to the fiction section to find it. I only read two pages at random. One was about two men having sex with a whore. It was pretty graphic but OK. But the other - they were in a dungeon where they were torturing people to death and having sex with them. I must add that it was written in the first person so it appeared to be the main character who was doing all of this (Juliette?). God I was horrified. I don't know why I kept reading but I read a whole page of the dungeon bit and then I got to a bit with a 12 year old boy.I had to put it down and go find my friend and have a cup of tea. (I'm so British...) Anyway - the write up on the back of the book used the word horrific so I probably should have been prepared. Obviously I read both bits out of context - and have no idea what the book is really about or if it has a message or what that message might be. Has anyone here read it? Would you tell me about it? My stomach can't take reading it again but I'm really curious about it. I will of course google it aswell.
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Marquis de Sade (Quills): Are your convictions so fragile they cannot stand in opposition to mine? Is your god so flimsy, so weak? For shame.

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(Date Posted:03/11/2007 23:43:05)

The book sounds great fun.......its 'my cup of tea'..all over. Looooverly ...

I recall seeing a great movie made a couple of years ago about his life...called   with Australian actor Geoffrey Rush. I highly recommend it. It shows how popular this kind of literature is....and at the same time how writer's of the day, are deemed to be criminals or insane for daring to write stuff (fiction)  that is against the rules.?

fuck that!

 

googled this....

His is a philosophy of extreme freedom (or at least licentiousness), unrestrained by morality, religion or law, with the pursuit of personal pleasure being the highest principle. Though never convicted of any crime, Sade was incarcerated in various prisons and in an insane asylum for 29 years of his life; much of his writing was done during this time. The term "sadism" is derived from his name.

 

 

ps.....before anyone sits on my head...I know ..I know...movies don't accurately portray anything....but history is also created in a similar manner.

The Cuteness
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(Date Posted:03/12/2007 13:53:04)

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The book sounds great fun.......its 'my cup of tea'..all over.Looooverly ...I recall seeing a great movie made a couple of years ago about his life...called with Australian actor Geoffrey Rush. I highly recommend it. It shows how popular this kind of literature is....and at the same time how writer's of the day, are deemed to be criminals or insane for daring to write stuff (fiction) that is against the rules.?fuck that!googled this....His is a philosophy of extreme





Thanks for the movie link chic - I will definately go and find it. I like Geoffrey Rush (although I only really know him as Captain Barbosa - "God" bless Jonny Depp)
I can't stop thinking about the book. Now that I have got over my shock - and it's taken me a few days - I want to go back and read it. It's challenging me.
I can't understand the extreme sort of freedom which says it is OK to torture and kill people for pleasure. It's so not OK. Even from an unemotional logical point of view it's not OK to hurt others for your pleasure if you are living in a society (unless they are masochists I suppose).
Do you have another point of view on this?
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Marquis de Sade (Quills): Are your convictions so fragile they cannot stand in opposition to mine? Is your god so flimsy, so weak? For shame.

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(Date Posted:03/12/2007 23:37:46)

Reply to : Dot
 

Oh yeah....I'd get on my knees for JonnyDepp! I didn't much enjoy the film 'the Libertine' Johnny Depp plays the main character, the 2nd Earl of Rochester - an english character only one generation removed from de Sade. .... "He didn't resist temptation. He pursued it." 

"Extreme sort of freedom'.......to me that means lots of things...but for now... to read books...and to write what you like. I haven't read his books closely enough ....so I can't really say how it might affect me but in my view the bible is doing the exactly that. Saying that's its OK to torture and kill people.  & I agree it not OK. One of the differences between a book like the bible and the literature of de Sade....is the religion of christianity, which to me is based on 'masochism'. Christianity has 'hurt' countless... sqwillions of people - justified by 'worship'. If that's not a 'pleasure' to those that 'feel god'....I don't know what is. On a personal level.....unlike the characters in a book from whom you don't need to get permission ....real life individuals, like myself have provided at times 'pleasure' to the christian without so much of a 'please' or 'thankyou'-  my permission is never an issue to an evangelisin' christian. To me that's a fuckedup 'freedom'.

I think you've hit on something that I'm interested in. I'd like to read more about his life and how his work has affected other's..(.its right up my alley.).....quotes Wikky...

Numerous writers and artistes, especially those concerned with sexuality, have been both repelled and fascinated by de Sade.

Simone de Beauvoir (in her essay Must we burn Sade?, published in Les Temps modernes, December 1951 and January 1952) and other writers have attempted to locate traces of a radical philosophy of freedom in Sade's writings, preceding that of existentialism by some 150 years. He has also been seen as a precursor of Sigmund Freud's psychoanalysis in his focus on sexuality as a motive force. The surrealists admired him as one of their forerunners, and Guillaume Apollinaire famously called him "the freest spirit that has yet existed".

Pierre Klossowski, in his 1947 book Sade Mon Prochain ("Sade My Neighbor"), analyzes Sade's philosophy as a precursor of Nietzsche's nihilism, negating both Christian values and the materialism of the Enlightenment.

 

From what I know of history ...de Sade didn't stand out as particularly 'evil' or 'brutal'. Back in those days....late 1700's Pre-revolution France, the upper classes openly  enjoy 'freedom' to brutalise the peasant population......& of course not only in France but England as well. The class system is a great example of how  'freedom'  is a term that's largely subjective. However to me de Sade,  stands out as a writer.

I don't see why his books were banned in England untill early 1980. ?

The goth novel called Justine: the misfortunes of virtue -  Vice vs. Virtue....Which can be read online ....seems like a very thought provoking book. ie...that   'virtue is a sacrifice' to me  seems to provoke a feeling that I'm familiar with. Also the idea that to break with traditions (any kind) is not something 'other's' will  be entirely happy about and judge 'you' as 'evil'.

I don't think the literature of de Sade...can influence 'you' without your permission.

Wealth and Pleasure be yours! If my scribblings have brought you a measure of both, set me to advantage on your bookshelf. If I have bored you, accept my apologies and consign me to the flames. -- The Marquis de Sade

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(Date Posted:03/13/2007 00:05:15)

Reply to : snakechic



Reply to : DotOh yeah....I'd get on my knees for JonnyDepp!I didn't much enjoy the film 'the Libertine'Johnny Depp plays the main character, the2nd Earl of Rochester- an english characteronly one generation removed from de Sade..... "He didn't resist temptation. He pursued it.""Extreme sort of freedom'.......to me that means lots of things...but for no





Oh The Libertine - I bought that on DVD and I've been saving it for an evening when I am a-hem alone...
But then my friend told me it was not good - that it was decidedly un-sexy and that he ends up with syphilis. What a disappointment! Maybe I'll stare at the picture instead!
I too am really fascinated by this Sade character. First I'm going to hunt out Quills and then I'm going to get that Juliette book again.
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Marquis de Sade (Quills): Are your convictions so fragile they cannot stand in opposition to mine? Is your god so flimsy, so weak? For shame.

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(Date Posted:04/04/2007 21:51:03)

Reply to : snakechic



Wey hey hey! Guess who picked up Quills in the local HMV for 6 British Pounds?

Can't wait to watch it!
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Marquis de Sade (Quills): Are your convictions so fragile they cannot stand in opposition to mine? Is your god so flimsy, so weak? For shame.

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(Date Posted:04/05/2007 01:39:15)

That's so cool Dot! I haven't managed to buy a copy yet but when I find one on sale...I sure will pick up a copy!!!!

Please tell us what you think....

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(Date Posted:04/05/2007 02:27:51)

Reply to : snakechic
That film was awesome!

Man I? so inspired and shocked and oooo.... I just feel deliciously, wickedly good.

There were some great lines

Marquis de Sade: Are your convictions so fragile they cannot stand in opposition to mine? Is your god so flimsey, so weak! For shame.

Marquis de Sade: Suppose one of your precious inmates attempted to walk on water and drowned, would you condemn the bible? I think not.

And Joaquin Pheonix as a bonus - mmmmm... mother may i... what a honey...

Good recommendation!!

xxxx
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Marquis de Sade (Quills): Are your convictions so fragile they cannot stand in opposition to mine? Is your god so flimsy, so weak? For shame.

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