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Didaktikon
Re :   Reply To MothandRust

G'day, Pete.

But I could start the argument by asking you if you think slavery is moral or immoral? There lies an interesting rabbit hole jaunt. I'd answer, "it depends". The binary way in which you framed your question doesn't consider context(s). I'm happy to tease out the implications of the question, if you're prepared to having your personal morality and consequent ethical understandings shaped.

I'm certainly not going to argue scriptures with Ian. Fair enough. Would you be prepared to have your underlying assumptions about a raft of issues tested instead? And would you be open to having the logic of your beliefs challenged as well? I submit the answers to these questions would likely open an even more interesting "rabbit hole jaunt" ;)

Children died gruesome deaths today when a car ran into a classroom. There is no god, and if there is his passiveness is 'evil'. Rubbish. Children die gruesome deaths every day; everywhere. The fact of death, even the death of innocents, says nothing about the existence or non-existence of the Christian God. Neither does the reality of death automatically imply or demand that God is somehow "passive" or "disinterested" about such things. Your charge is based on little more than kindergarten-level reasoning; it might be worthy of a Revivalist, but it should be beneath you.

Blessings,

Ian


11/11/2017 11:32 PM


Biblianut
Re :   Gay Marriages

Hi Mothy,

Slavery is an interesting topic. Simple answer from me, I believe is immoral in oppressing fellow mankind. The other side of the coin is of course ”slavery to Christ” and how Christianity justified it in the past. Lots of reading to do on that. Thank God slavery is illegal today.

Let me say my of point of view (Noetic structure “recognises the differing degrees of certainty, firmness, and conviction w/ which people hold their beliefs”), comes from reading, listening and excepting those that have done much more research and learning in languages (eg Ian's knowledge of the Kione creek), philosophy, different themes of bible studies and so forth, notwithstanding my own experiences on my religious journey.

There is much mystery in this life that is beyond human comprehension and understanding, we can only accept it, or not, by reason and logic.

We can define 'sin' as really as breaking of a rule set down by our creator. God gave ‘Adam and Eve’ only one rule and that was not to eat of the tree of good and evil (whatever that means) but they broke that rule, thus sin and evil comes into the picture. Mankind became separated from having a relationship with God.

It is a tragedy what happened today with the school event, brings us to morals, sin and evil. All three interact.

We question why there are tragedies and disasters. God seems to get the blame any way.

Two types of evil exist; moral evil, the troubles that man brings upon himself by wrongful deeds and natural evil (gratuitous evil), disasters like earth quakes, weather patterns, tsunamis, etc., which sometimes termed “acts of God.”

One can easily determine what is the moral evil that is brought about by man’s wrongful actions himself and suffers the consequence, but the question of natural evil why it happens or for what good reason does it happen is much more complex.

From a Christian POV, God allows these things to happen to bring about either a greater good or destroy a greater evil.

I believe only from the bible (Sola Scriptura) can a satisfactory conclusion be decided, but one has to believe first.

Ralph.

(sourced from N T Wright, Bill Mounce and bible) 



08/11/2017 6:37 AM


MothandRus
Re :   Reply To Biblianut

Reply to Biblianut

All your other hooha about 'sin' is ridiculous though. I'll come back and make my point about that at some point.

Looking forward to YOUR point of view on why there is 'morality' and 'immorality' on earth.

Sounds like an exercise in futility... 
But I could start the argument by asking you if you think slavery is moral or immoral? There lies an interesting rabbit hole jaunt.

I'm certainly not going to argue scriptures with Ian. 

Children died gruesome deaths today when a car ran into a classroom. There is no god, and if there is his passiveness is 'evil'.


07/11/2017 6:39 AM


TwikieB
Re :   What are you reading at the moment ?

 Thanks Ralph,

Very good!! Those who took the battles before us paved the way for us leaving... and it was by realising many others had gone before, pointing out the same things that we finally saw, that gave us the evidence of the lies, cover-ups, character assasinations and all that the CAI self appointed leaders had been conducting ever since the very beginning...

... which takes me to the next point: for some years now, I have been waiting to see whether Franz would put some action to his words. "The Bible, of course" in response to my direct question to some people's faces: "should there be evidence to contradiction between the assembly teaching and the Bible - the New Testsament - what should one obey?". Since that is not happening, the time has come for the next step: To ensure that the properties are used for true charity, money paid to the victims who suffered the most during their time in the cult prison, and then a due commitance to serving those who suffered and devoting the remainder of their lives to charity....

... soon the call is going out to them... or they will see the consequences of their unwillingness to respond to the truth and love so badly needed. Another call is about to go out to those of you out there willing to join the next wave....




03/11/2017 6:27 AM


Biblianut
Re :   Gay Marriages

 Not only does the biblical story of Sodom & Gomorrah show the homosexuality of the men but also the selfishness and self-gratification of the women also. It's history reveals the corruption and crime, that the people had become. Our nation/s are becoming just that, They are turning their backs on our Creator and giving over to their own selfish lusts which will lead to troubles and destruction. We as a people are becoming nothing more than, 'heathen'. God help us.

http://www.pinknews.co.uk/2017/10/18/prime-minister-theresa-may-addresses-pinknews-awards/


22/10/2017 5:07 AM


Didaktikon
Re :   Reply To MothandRust

G'day, Pete.

I look forwards to seeing you share your views on the subject of sin, but for now I'll point out I'm surprised you found the arguments put forwards in the "six Scriptures" piece convincing. I could easily drive an "exegetical bus" through the many and varied holes such argumentation contains, and having briefly 'Googled' the subject, I discovered a raft of biblical scholars already have! The positions generally proposed by the pro- crowd when appealing to Scripture invariably miss the mark historically, culturally and linguistically. This latest example is simply more of the same.

The rejection shown to gays by Christians and churches is indeed shameful, and should be sorely repented of. I indicated as much, in this very thread, six years ago (see post #10). However, suggesting that homosexuality as expressed in "a loving, committed, and monogamous way" is biblically a neutral matter, is naught but wishful thinking; it's simply an untenable position to adopt.

The following brief rebuttal of Matthew Vines' "six Scriptures" piece is nothing, if not interesting. Note particularly, the author is, himself, same-sex attracted:

http://www.christianitytoday.com/ct/2014/june-web-only/why-matthew-vines-is-wrong-about-bible-same-sex-relationshi.html?start=1

I've no doubts the 'Yes!' campaign will carry the day. And as I pointed out six years ago, such won't cause me to lose a wink's sleep! There are far more pressing issues for me to concern myself with. That many who profess Christian belief continue to support such a change, and that they do so via appeals to Christ's mandate to "love others", simply confirms that biblical and theological illiteracy continues to be a profound issue in many Australian communions and churches.

Blessings,

Ian


12/10/2017 1:31 AM


Biblianut
Re :   Gay Marriages

All your other hooha about 'sin' is ridiculous though. I'll come back and make my point about that at some point.

Looking forward to YOUR point of view on why there is 'morality' and 'immorality' on earth.


07/10/2017 1:21 AM


MothandRus
Re :   Gay Marriages

What's 'my' point? I haven't really shared my point. I did however find this article interesting for Christians to read. I don't believe the bible is written by a god to people so my perspective is different, of course.
All your other hooha about 'sin' is ridiculous though. I'll come back and make my point about that at some point.


05/10/2017 11:16 PM


Biblianut
Re :   Gay Marriages

Hi Mothy,

I don't know what is your point here, whether they are homosexual or not?

If one wishes to express their sexuality outside of marriage (ie one man and one women only) by having a sexual relationship, be it same-sex, adultery, another's spouse or whatever, is a SIN and will not go away unpunished.

What is written and my own experience, there is always a negative response having gone against that law set down by God, whether it is immediate or in time, there is always a reaction to it.

Old testament law, if broken, had an immediate punishment dished out to those that sinned.

In the New Testament that law is no longer imputed toward those that believe in Christ and repent of their actions. The “law is written in their hearts by the Holy Spirit” and do not continue in sin.

This does not apply to those of unbelief and continue in their activities as those that “Live by the law, will be judged by the law” and held in store at final judgement. Notwithstanding the negative impact of it now.

I see the whole narrative of the bible is showing us God put down the law(moral) for our own well being and good, in this life and that to come.

Going against it we reap the consequences.

Grace and peace

Ralph.

PS God puts much importance on sexual immorality: Flee from sexual immorality. All other sins a person commits are outside the body, but whoever sins sexually, sins against their own body........ 1Corinthians 6:12-18 




01/10/2017 6:12 PM


MothandRus
Re :   Gay Marriages

There are 6 Scriptures about homosexuality in the Bible. Here's what they really say.

The Story of Sodom & Gomorrah (Genesis 19)

This story in Genesis 19 is probably the most popular passage used to condemn homosexuality. Here is how Vines explains it:

"God sends two angels disguised as men into the City of Sodom where the men of Sodom threatened to rape them. The angels blind the men, and God destroys the city. For centuries, this story was interpreted as God's judgment on same-sex relations, but the only form of same-sex behavior described is a threatened gang rape. "

So gang rape = not good (also not the same thing as homosexuality). But the recap of Sodom & Gomorrah found in Ezekial 16:49 highlights what Vines believes is the real point of the story:

"Now, this was the sin of your sister, Sodom. She and her daughters were arrogant, overfed, and unconcerned, they did not help the poor and needy."

In other words, everyone using this story as evidence of the sin of homosexuality, might be missing the point entirely.

When God calls homosexuality an abomination 
(Leviticus 18:22) (Leviticus 20:13)

Yep. We've all heard that Leviticus is where the Bible straight-up says that homosexual behavior is an abomination. And yes, it does. It also says that homosexuals should receive the death penalty (!!!). It also says the same thing about eating pork or shellfish, charging interest on loans, and a whole bunch of other restrictions that were a part of the Old Testament Law Code. But for Christians, the Old Testament doesn't (dare I say "shouldn't?") settle any issue because Romans 10:4 says that Christ is the end of the law. Which is probably why most Christians today eat meat, use credit cards, wear makeup, and support equality for women. Because, as Hebrews 8:13 says, the old law is obsolete and aging.

When people turn away from God (Romans 1:26-27)

"Even their women exchanged natural sexual relations for unnatural ones; in the same way, men committed shameful acts with other men and received in themselves the due penalty for their error."

This is where Vines really digs in on the the cultural context angle. In Biblical times, same-sex behavior was primarily seen as happening between adult men and adolescent boys (masters and servants — yikes), via prostitution, and by men who were married to women. In all of those cases, we can see why it would have been viewed as sinful, excessive, lustful, and against God's law. But he makes no mention of love, commitment, faithfulness, or the type of same-sex relationships that are at question in the debate around marriage. (By the way, Paul also says that men having long hair is "unnatural" and that women shouldn't speak in church, so it's clear Paul himself may have had some issues of his own.)

Uses of the Greek works "Malakoi" and "Arsenokoitai" 
(1 Corinthians 6:9-10) (1 Timothy 1:10)

These words are included in the New Testament's lists of people who will not inherit God's kingdom. And there has been much debate over their original meaning. (Translating ancient words is hard, guys.) Some believe them to mean homosexuality and sodomy, whereas others have said that the closest modern translation would be "dirty old men." Ha! Here's how Vines explains it:

Many modern translators have rendered these terms as sweeping statements about gay people, but the concept of sexual orientation didn't even exist in the ancient world. Yes, Paul did not take a positive view of same-sex relations (nor did he support women speaking in church...), but the context he was writing in is worlds apart from gay people in committed, monogamous relationships. The Bible never addresses the issues of sexual orientation or same-sex marriage, so there's no reason why faithful Christians can't support their gay brothers and sisters.

Fascinating, right?

If you'd like to learn more and hear Matthew Vines' story, check out the video above and his book "God and the Gay Christian."




30/09/2017 11:56 PM


Biblianut
Re :   Gay Marriages

 As a responsible Christian, it is comforting to note Churches confirm their commitment to the God given institution of marriage between a man and a women only. Those that don't have lost the plot completely.

https://www.eternitynews.com.au/in-depth/fact-check-what-do-christian-churches-really-think-about-same-sex-marriage/


18/09/2017 5:24 PM


Biblianut
Re :   What are you reading at the moment ?

Hey Neddles, you just need to be appreciative of those that have come before you, have done most of the hard work.
With out the help and blessing of the Spirit in their lives, many of us would still be in as much ignorance today as there was/is in Revival.

Nothing comes easy, much work and sacrifice is still 
required and God will make things new.

God bless

Ralph.


17/09/2017 7:30 AM


Zamoz
Re :   What are you reading at the moment ?

 How to Read the Bible for All Its Worth
Book by Gordon Fee

Well written, but it seems a lot of work to just understand the Bible, Surely or Flying High movie Shirly, it must be easier to read the good book than taking 500 hours to work out the meaning of a scripture, then not every one will come to the same conclusion.

Neddles is still searching


17/09/2017 6:07 AM


Zamoz
Re :   Gay Marriages

 The question should be via the postal vote, Do you want freedom of choice/ belief/ speech,, I think 95% of Australians would say yes, so automaticlly if Homosexuals want to form a bond it has nothing to with those who don,t like it.

Second question on the postal vote should be,  Is the word marriage to be used for a man- woman only, again most Aussies would vote yes.

So now a gay couple can be joined together, under not marriage but let then come up with their own word, for the Male- female here's your Marriage certificate, for the gays here's your Civil bond/ civil Union/ Gay bondship, certificate or what ever word the gay want to use, except the word marriage, SO the question asking do you want gay marriage, will force a lot of christians to vote No, God gave humans the choice my way or no eternal life, I can not find a quote where God said be angry and despise Gays and those who don't live their life God's way.

Love you fellow man woman as your own child.


10/09/2017 5:46 AM


Biblianut
Re :   Gay Marriages

About not judging.

The Bible says that Christians should not judge the morality nor the behaviour of others”.

This always comes from those supporting things like same-sex marriage.

Luke 6:37 is often quoted.

This is true, but taken out of context.

If we look further, we find Jesus did not relieve us of the need for discerning right and wrong.

Christians are not to judge hypocritically or self-righteously (Matt 7:1-5) but it does not preclude another person's basic character and we evaluate between good and bad people (sexual immorality in this case). Not a case of judging but pointing out the wrong and showing which direction to go. for ones own good.

Teaching about the Kingdom, of course, should be given in accordance with the learners spiritual capacity (V6).

Sadly,people don't realise that God is 'sovereign' and it is he that judges good and evil.

The bible is written and instruction is given for our own good, in this life and that to come.


Ralph



08/08/2017 6:08 AM


Stawde
Re :   Leaving the GRC and Salvation

 I found the answer in the GRC history section. Sorry for posting it in the wrong place. Obviously I am new and not from GRC and never shall be after reading this forum. Thanks.


14/07/2017 8:33 PM


Stawde
Re :   Leaving the GRC and Salvation

 Is the revival center in Mumbai/Goa in India affiliated with GRC? The pastor is someone with the name of Colaco. A member was trying to recruit us and I wanted to know more. 


14/07/2017 12:24 AM


Didaktikon
Re :   Reply To Didaktikon

Good evening, all.

The results of the 2016 Australian census are progressively being released. I hope to post a summary soon, listing the most up-to-date adherence figures for the Revival Centres and the Revival Fellowship.

God bless,

Ian



28/06/2017 5:34 AM


Didaktikon
Re :   Reply To Zamoz

Zamoz,

Iv moved on, Its nice to keep the seat warm, on sundays, with the only church around for 300 k, even though he's a Roman Catholic priest, the word could come from any pastor, in most of his sermons, he's not against full water baptism if people want it, but he never ask them if they want it, and for the babies, is just get them wet, then later when they have the understanding, they can go for the full dip. Baptism happens once. Being baptised as a child in a Christian communion doesn't equal "getting a baby wet", it equals baptism. So anyone who suggests, mandates or demands that "full dips" occur later in that child's life clearly doesn't understand Old and New Testament biblical theology, nor the explicit New Testament teaching on baptism itself.

There are a few people here all indigenous who said they would like to meet for a house bible reading and explaining of the text, like why full baptism is needed, might scan the net and get some good points and scripture, slow and easy. "Full baptism", which you obviously take to be baptism by immersion, is no greater or lesser a form of baptism than is baptism by pouring. That you don't understand this tells me you're not ready to be teaching others yet.

Blessings,

Ian


24/06/2017 10:13 PM


Biblianut
Re :   On purity, defilement and legalism

Zamoz,

'Sex sins' etc is no different from any form of sin, save the sin of blasphemy of the Holy Ghost, is forgivable.
However, in the New Testament, Jesus puts a lot of emphasis on the particular subject, specifically when it comes to marriage relationships etc.
The Church's role is to support and guide those, that may have fallen to temptation and repented, back to redemption in Christ.

Accolades for attending the local church.

Baptism is not a requirement but an act of faith. Read- http://forum1.aimoo.com/revival/Please-Consider-An-examination-of-Revivalist-teachings-and-doctrines/Baptism-1-1020829.html

Ralph







23/06/2017 11:44 PM


Zamoz
Re :   On purity, defilement and legalism

 I never stop wondering why RCI and others put people out for just fornication, in the above post there are many sins against defilement, yet they just put their hand into the sin bin and only pull out Sex sins, I never understand why they think sex sins are the sin they must put people out, a strange legalism in their brain that a sex sin is unforgiven, they show little fruits of the spirit in Love forgiveness.

Iv moved on, Its nice to keep the seat warm, on sundays, with the only church around for 300 k, even though he's a Roman Catholic priest, the word could come from any pastor, in most of his sermons, he's not against full water baptism if people want it, but he never ask them if they want it, and for the babies, is just get them wet, then later when they have the understanding, they can go for the full dip.

There are a few people here all indigenous who said they would like to meet for a house bible reading and explaining of the text, like why full baptism is needed, might scan the net and get some good points and scripture, slow and easy.


23/06/2017 9:11 AM


Biblianut
Re :   On purity, defilement and legalism

 Copy and paste from "Got any questions.org", https://www.gotquestions.org/fruit-of-the-Holy-Spirit.html  

may be helpful.-


 Question: "What is the fruit of the Holy Spirit?"

Answer: Galatians 5:22-23 tells us, “But the fruit of the Spirit is love, joy, peace, patience, kindness, goodness, faithfulness, gentleness and self-control.” The fruit of the Holy Spirit is the result of the Holy Spirit’s presence in the life of a Christian. The Bible makes it clear that everyone receives the Holy Spirit the moment he or she believes in Jesus Christ (Romans 8:9; 1 Corinthians 12:13; Ephesians 1:13-14). One of the primary purposes of the Holy Spirit coming into a Christian's life is to change that life. It is the Holy Spirit's job to conform us to the image of Christ, making us more like Him.

The fruit of the Holy Spirit is in direct contrast with the acts of the sinful nature in Galatians 5:19-21, “The acts of the sinful nature are obvious: sexual immorality, impurity and debauchery; idolatry and witchcraft; hatred, discord, jealousy, fits of rage, selfish ambition, dissensions, factions and envy; drunkenness, orgies, and the like. I warn you, as I did before, that those who live like this will not inherit the kingdom of God.” This passage describes all people, to varying degrees, when they do not know Christ and therefore are not under the influence of the Holy Spirit. Our sinful flesh produces certain types of fruit that reflect our nature, and the Holy Spirit produces types of fruit that reflect His nature.

The Christian life is a battle of the sinful flesh against the new nature given by Christ (2 Corinthians 5:17). As fallen human beings, we are still trapped in a body that desires sinful things (Romans 7:14-25). As Christians, we have the Holy Spirit producing His fruit in us and we have the Holy Spirit's power available to conquer the acts of the sinful nature (2 Corinthians 5:17; Philippians 4:13). A Christian will never be completely victorious in always demonstrating the fruits of the Holy Spirit. It is one of the main purposes of the Christian life, though, to progressively allow the Holy Spirit to produce more and more of His fruit in our lives—and to allow the Holy Spirit to conquer the opposing sinful desires. The fruit of the Spirit is what God desires our lives to exhibit and, with the Holy Spirit's help, it is possible!

More on Spiritual gifts.- https://www.gotquestions.org/QOTW.htm



19/06/2017 5:58 PM


Zamoz
Re :   On purity, defilement and legalism

 Salvation is simply a processof confessing and believing, that Jesus died and rose again for our sins, tomake way for acceptance by the father we are worthy, before this nothing we didwould be acceptable to enter eternal rest. A man must confess that Jesus isLord, which signifies his realization that Christ must have full rule over hislife with all His righteous requirements, from his we show outward belief bybeing baptised into the corporate Christian church.

Saved from what, for mesaved from the evil of this world mankind and his crimes and thoughts againstGod, then to produce the fruits of the spirit as evidence you are followingJesus way.



19/06/2017 4:38 AM


Biblianut
Re :   On purity, defilement and legalism

Neddles, 

So I was looking to do a Fri-Sat evening Talk/ chat/ asking are they Baptised/ do they want to be saved/..........

I'm curious to know how you would answer those, if they wanted to know, "how to be saved" and what from?

Ralph.


26/05/2017 8:15 AM


Zamoz
Re :   On purity, defilement and legalism

 Thanks Ian

Only Church in town is Roman Catholic, next town is 300k away dirt road about 6-7 hours drive.

So I was looking to do a Fri-Sat evening Talk/ chat/ asking are they Baptised/ do they want to be saved/ do they find it hard to not want to get revenge on their neighbour/ why they want revenge or hate their neighbour, do they believe God can help, Once I get to that stage, I can proceed further with whos interested in doing some bible study working through scripture to help them decide is Gods way the best way for keeping peace, Starts off more like a mediation process.

Yuendumu community 6 years ago, same problem with fights, hatred, took 2 years for the town to come to agreement, lots of Social workers Elders many meetings to get to a decision to stop the violence, in the mean time, some 12 local christians meet weekly for a service in a private house, I got invited in, got asked to do some easy understandably talks on forgivness, most of which I found on the net and took notes and gave scripture quotes, English is their second language, you may remember Ally Waria from Brisbane, she came out here, small world, All I can do is see wait and find my place, if there is one in this Indigenous community, let the spirit lead me as God wills.

Here is one of many vid of street fights in town, there's a whole FB page of fights 100s, this one is not that violent
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pGIubtqroNc

Thanks for the chat

Godspeed

Neddles


24/05/2017 8:58 AM


Didaktikon
Re :   On purity, defilement and legalism

Neddles,

My advice to you would be this: based on what you've shared thus far, you're probably not adequately prepared or equipped to take on the responsibility of teaching others in a small group yet. I reckon you'd be better served joining a local Christian church and committing yourself to it first, in lockstep with continuing your current ministry of practical help and engagement within the community.

When all is said and done, there are no valid reasons, and no valid excuses, for a Christian not being discipled in a local church.

Blessings,

Ian


19/05/2017 10:12 PM


Zamoz
Re :   On purity, defilement and legalism

 So not a good idea to have a bible chat group in the community, 1 against.
I did start a small bible talk group up in a community Indigenous back in 2002, it was aimed at the kids, I started to walk around town with a wheelie bin after work and pick up all the rubbish in the street, about 3 k of road, so I would do a bit every day,  some kids joined me to help out, they got rewarded with a ride out of town to the tip, to them the 3 k trip was fun, then I gave them some food, soon word got around and every afternoon the kids got more involved, with more kids helping, got about 25 on average, so invited an adult Indigenous to help supervise, 5 kids would sit in the back of the truck 1 in the front plus the Adult, for the drive to the tip every day, never got out of first gear about 20k/per hour, then on Saturday the kids who help out the most would get to go to the Black Boy camp, about 20K out of town and hunt for Porkipines, and pick up fire wood, when we came back we would boil up potatoes with bread and butter, by now I had 2 adults helping out, So I got use of the local hall and the kitchen on Saturday afternoon after the Black Boy run with the kids and adults and started to say a prayer before having the snack, soon other mums and dad started to come along after the rubbish cleanup and tip trips, they just loved the Great stories of the bible, raising from the dead, Samson, we had a TV in the hall got some bible movies, Saturday tip run turned into a chat study about the bible, got the kids entertained, spoke about why its not ok to fight, bully other kids, 3 months later we had 15 adults 20+ kids coming to the hall for several hours, 

We were 3 hours from Rocky, and a local church there asked if the could come out, they read about my afternoons in the local paper, so the Pastor and friends would come out every second Saturday for the fun games bible chat stay the night and stay for a Sunday morning service, then head back to rocky, but that community was reasonable quite, compared to the current one I am in, and closed to a major city.

Any advice is most welcome, wait and see what happens I suppose, I hate a dirty town so I'll be doing the same thing talking to the locals with wheelie bin in hand after work picking up rubbish and see what comes about, Outreach by Stealth, sooner or later usually the woman are the most friendly to a Whitey, they say I am not well or we need more rooms, the toilet needs fixing, I can help out with maintenance, and with your illness can I have a prayer for you, I am no great evangelist, preacher or talker, but should we not pass on the word in our daily lives, some churches do have regular weekly outreaches, I never been go at starting a conversation up cold turkey about God, but I am good at civil housing construction, walking the street saying hello in a casual manner to find what needs to be done, rather than call a community meeting to express their troubles, improvements they want done.

Whats right or wrong with the method??, is there a legalism I am applying that I should not be doing in my thinking??

Neddles


16/05/2017 3:12 AM


Zamoz
Re :   On purity, defilement and legalism

  I've always had a hard time thinking, How can you (Priest) wear such things and make you look and act holy, gives a false show to followers, then there is all the other paraphernalia stations of the cross, blessing one self, sprinkling, Etc, big time events in the Philippines. Sprinkling baptisms, statues, gold chalice the list goes on, seems to me once you start one ritual others follow, the more rituals the more it takes away from the teachings, I must think , They have their reward in, out ward presentations.

SO I always get caught out when I see such people, the way I think, Praise the lord I say to my self, don't judge, forgive me Jesus I just failed again, I must improve, those people who dress like that, in some way are still passing on some of jesus ways to those who listen, Like the Local Priest said, They come to me when they see the collar, might not agree with that or his church doctrine, but there are some basic love the RC church gives out. let them be.

So now the question is, will I play along with the only church in town, as it was the church who made the mission back 80 years ago.
I have been thinking about putting out some leaflets for a local house meeting, bible study basic, as my job I get to meet every one in town thats Wadeye, a vile revengeful place, plenty riots, tribe squabbles, social problems hatred, just the usual Indigenous community I go to after they settle down to rebuild, been doing it 30+ years, just take it in my stride, seen it all before, petrol sniffing, bashing old grandmothers with fence paling, open fist fights in the street, drugs, smelly people, mind boggling for someone new to the experience, praise God keep me alive this long, been 2 years since first was coming here, was put off twice due to violence, now things are ripe, government money rebuilding, so they asked me to come out, as a specialist Indigenous Trainer builder, 

Get that feeling I should start a meeting group up, probable during the week Friday night, Learning this new Legalism, by trying not to down grade the local RC church, or what others or doing, or judging who bashed who, and who dresses wrong, Must think forgiveness, and no judging, accept all.

As I don't have a regular church home church, closest home church would be a group near my home base Ipswich, last time there was 2 years ago, so I move around with work, never been able to stay in one place long enough, plenty prayer asking for a steady job, but when ones job is complete into the next one, from 6 to 18 months most last.

What advice can the this  board give to a fellow traveller christian, wanting to start up a house meeting, every community I have been in before has had several church groups in town, very strange the largest community in NT has only one church with 2500 population. Worrabinda has population of 500+ and had several churches, some churches visit once a month from the larger towns and bring out their followers, some every 2 weeks, during the off week there would be house meetings, but this new place has just one, no one has come from any other churches to start up a new group, there are a few from Darwin who come for outreach, fishing trip a few times a year, that's real fishing barra and do some church service or put on nights entertainment, got me stumped why only RC are based here, either way Uncle Neddles is getting itchy feet and needs more in my life. its eat sleep and work here, some other bible needs wanted. The hairs on the neck stand up when in a RC church, I was brought up as RC,

Open for suggestions, what would be a good opening talk? what heading to put on the leaflet drop??? An alternative to stopping suicide, in your community, (Indigenous communities have twice the death rate of standard Australia) or Living Working and Surviving in Indigenous communities for 40 years from a white fella, Bringing peace to you and your family, Forgiving your neighbour is from God.

Any help would be thankful. Plenty time to talk to my self here, time for prayer and ask directions.

Neddles


15/05/2017 10:02 AM


Biblianut
Re :   On purity, defilement and legalism

Ian,

I was extremely bigoted toward the wearing of investments in churches today. This I realize it just came from Revivalist thinking and is trivial. Much more important matters to focus on.

My minister explained it comes over from OT teaching and is mainly church tradition and identifies the position of office within.

Ralph. 




13/05/2017 10:14 PM


Didaktikon
Re :   On purity, defilement and legalism

Neddles,

If anyone is worried about a priest wearing vestments, then s/he is worrying over trifling cultural matters of no spiritual consequence whatsoever. It might help to think of it this way: there are occasions when it's valid for me to wear a doctoral gown and bonnet. There are occasions when it's valid for me to wear a business suit. And there are occasions when it's valid for me to wear 'boardies' and thongs. It's the context of each occasion that determines the validity or otherwise of what it is I wear. Similarly, in the more liturgical communions of the Christian Church the wearing of vestments by clergy is perfectly valid in the context of a church service, or the delivery of a sacrament.

Blessings,

Ian


12/05/2017 5:19 AM

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