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Title: Have Surp WC860 How can I use It?
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armexman
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(Date Posted:01/14/2005 19:59:33)
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I Bought a Jug to use in 8mm,6.5 Swede,30-06, other than castpics which has many loads, any other places I can find loads or equivelant powder burn rates I can start at. This is from a GIBRASS.com order Lot #AA8600 .Accurate Has loads for 8700 that are at around 54grains is that a good place to start as Ed at gibrass has it as equivelant to H870 or 8700 Gracias.
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armexman

Maven
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(Date Posted:01/14/2005 22:50:42)

Armexman, You can use WC 860 in all three cals. you listed, but be aware that there'll be a good deal of unburned powder, which will work its way into the chamber and dent your cases if you don't swab after every 5-10 rounds. For the 6.5 Swede and CB's bet. 140 & 150grs., try 32-35grs. 860 with magnum primers. For the .30-06, with CB's bet. 170 & 195grs., start at 48grs. 860 with a mag. primer. What's good in the '06 is also good in the 8mm Mau. Please note that although I've tried the loads I mentioned for the 6.5 x 55mm, I was never happy with them. The better way is to use a rifle powder with a burning rate similar to H/IMR 4198, which would also include VV N133 and AA 5744. If you're open to suggestion, 13-15grs. WC 820 works beautifully in the 6.5 x 55 and you won't need magnum primers either. You will have to make absolutely sure you don't double charge a case with it, however. In fact, it will work in the other two as well, but at 18grs. and 20grs., respectively. ...Maven
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Buckshot2
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(Date Posted:01/15/2005 06:51:48)

..............Armexman, WC860 is as you know, SLOOOOOOOOW. In just about any standard sized unbelted cartridge case you can just about scoop the case though a bowl of powder and cram a slug on top. Since it IS so slow and with representative load data, it is fairly easy to extrapolate load data for other cartridges.

Speaking of these 'standard' type cases, the 7x57 and 6.5x55 with full loads of WC860 generate original military ballistics with jacketed AND cast boolits, plus it burns clean due to useable pressures. Of course at that velocity the Swede is a wash with cast! As the bore size increases, pressure drops some and you begin to get incomplete combustion. Naturally, working in the other direction such as the 257 Roberts with it's smaller bore and higher expansion ratio, allow the powder to increase it's efficiency.

You can mitigate the lower pressure with same same cases-larger bore, to a degree by changing to pressure building components. Magnum primers, roll crimp, heavier boolits, and seating firmly into the lands are common means. I don't have any cartridges built on the 308 case, but I would imagine in the 7-08 and smaller bores it would be a good choice. The parent 308 might be marginal (guessing here) but would obviously present no pressure problems.

It's use in most any straight case is pretty poor, even with really heavy boolits and all the other stuff used. In testing in the 45-90 nothing helped. After doing some duplexing in the 45-70 with such great results, I tried it in the 45-90. That data is on Castpics and results weren't as good. All that slow ball powder sitting there presented a considerable column of weight in addition to the slug and the duplex charge had a tough row to how. I saw pressure signs before any great improvement in overall combustion took place.

..................Buckshot

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Father Grand Caster watches over you my brother. Go now and pour yourself a hot one. May the Sacred Silver Stream be with you always

Proud former Shooters.Com Cast Bullet alumnus and plank owner

Deputy Al
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(Date Posted:01/15/2005 17:49:06)

Addendum to Buckshot's text, regarding straight-wall calibers and WC-860.......I have used about 8# of the stuff in the 45-70, mostly using the Lee 405 plain base atop 48.0 grain of WC-860 with 3.0 grains of IMR-4198 "duplexed".  This powder amount was 100% loading density, and was lit with Federal 215 primers. 

The duplexing did clean up some of the unburned powder kernels, but not all of them.  Running a fluffed dry patch on a slotted end/cleaning rod takes care of the problem.  Not as convenient in a Marlin 95 as in my Ruger #1, but there it is there.  The velocities produced with there loads were a bit disappointing--around 1000 FPS with wider variations than the load's accuracy would indicate.

I have pretty much given up on WC-860 in the 45-70 with the 300 and 400 grain boolits.  While accurate for 50 yard shooting like the Burrito Matches, the velocity for hunting isn't there, and I suspect for longer ranges a LOT of vertical stringing would occur.  I do have some 550 grain/Lyman #462550 with the 100% density loads all stuffed and ready for testing.  Having fired some of these without benefit of chronography, I can say that the loads are accurate and that they produce markedly sharper recoil--more so than simple boolit weight would account for, methinks.  The chrono will have to confirm that the snug bore riding nose--boolit shoulder snugged against the #1's steep rifling origin--and 150 more grains of lead is causing more consistent and efficient combustion to occur.       

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Fortuna favorat fortis

armexman
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(Date Posted:01/19/2005 18:15:33)

Reply to : Deputy Al

Addendum to Buckshot's text, regarding straight-wall calibers and WC-860.......I have used about 8# of the stuff in the 45-70, mostly using the Lee 405 plain base atop 48.0 grain of WC-860 with 3.0 grains of IMR-4198 "duplexed". Thispowder amount was 100% loading density, and was lit with Federal 215 primers.The duplexing did clean up some of the unburned powder kernels, but not all of them. Running a fluffed dry patch on aslotted end/cleaning rod takes care of the problem. Notas convenient in a Marlin 95 as in my Ruger #1, but there it is there. The velocities produced with there loads were a bit disappointing--around 1000 FPS with wider variations than the load's accuracy would indicate.I have pretty much given up on WC-860 in the 45-70 with the 300 and 400 grain boolits. While accurate for 50 ya
Thank you all for the info, I will use it this week for shooting on saturday. Will post results next week. I will use 8x57, 6.5x55 and 7x57 loads. first 98/22 ,second m96, third 1912 Chilean mauser all with 29" barrel,at 50 yards. Gracias otra vez.
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armexman

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