One of the moulds I got from the estate buy is a Lyman 450229. In WW it weighs 165gn. In style I will call it a SWC with two grooves and three bands and it is hollow base with a very large hollow. In WW it drops at .457". I thought it was for old 45 colts that had .457" throats but the weight is too light so what is it?

In use I am thinking a light 45/70 boolit for JR.or seated base forward in 45 Colt or acp would make a nasty looking round that should expand at low velocity.                          

Thoughts please.

BIC/BS

Bull Shop:

No. 450229 was introduced by Lyman sometime in the early 1950's, "...for the [.44] cap and ball revolver[s]."  (It was a "recycling" of the cherry number from an old Ideal #308229, discontinued just after 1900.)  You are lucky it casts so large; you can re-size it as needed (takes a #460 top punch) for any of the .45 handguns, and should make a nice plinker for the .45-70 and up rifles, with the hollow base obturating to fit any of the oversize bores.

(This was a chance to exercise the indexes I am working up of Lyman/Ideal bullets, top punches, etc.)

floodgate1

Bullshop-

 You are lucky to have one that casts that large. mine casts about .454" and doesn't work for the rifles too well. It weights a little more than a RB or the collar button bullet, so would work very well for a rabbit load for Jr. If you want, PM me and I will give you a good small game load to use with it.

---

Bull Shop:No. 450229 was introduced by Lyman sometime in the early 1950's, "...for the [.44] cap and ball revolver[s]." (It was a "recycling" of the cherry number from an old Ideal #308229, discontinued just after 1900.) You are lucky it casts so large; you can re-size it as needed (takes a #460 top punch) for any of the .45 handguns, and should make a nice plinker for the .45-70 and up rifles, with the hollow base obturating to fit any of the oversize bores.(This was a chance to exercise the indexes I am working up of Lyman/Ideal bullets, top punches, etc.)floodgate1

---

C1PNR:

No, it will just be a listing with bullet mould number in the first column, Top Punch number next and Seating Screw in the third.  These are culled from the 1958 "Handbook of Cast Bullets", the 1973 2nd Edition "Cast Bullet Handbook", and various Lyman Annual Product Catalogs thereafter.  You'd have to go to these to get the pictures (the 2nd Edition is posted on CASTPICS, but I believe one page has dropped out).  I have other lists in process which give ALL the bullets shown in each Handbook from 1897 (when they first started using the "modern" numbers) down into the '50's (when Lyman stopped showing all the bullets in their line), then the two Cast Bullet books, and the Annual catalogs from mid-50's to date.  But you have to look at the HB's and Catalogs for the pictures.  The TP list is over 400 lines, and the bullet lists around 700 - 'way too many for pictures.  If you can use a listing from the MSWorks spreadsheet or database format, I can put them on a disk or CD and you can call out whatever sorting you need: by TP number if you've got one in hand and want to know what bullet(s) it will fit; or if you've got a bullet mould and want to know what TP (or 310 tool Seating Stem) to use with it.  This is a "labor of love", and - like most such - is complicated at some times, and frustrating at others.  OTOH, if you've got a specific question like Bull Shop's, PM me I can look up the answer for you and maybe send you a scan* of the bullet in question, date and description of its origin, and purpose for which designed.  I can also do this for most Modern-Bond and Belding & Mull moulds, but not for other makes.

floodgate1

* My scanner is down, but I hope to get a replacement this weekend.

---

Bull Shop:No. 450229 was introduced by Lyman sometime in the early 1950's, "...for the [.44] cap and ball revolver[s]." (It was a "recycling" of the cherry number from an old Ideal #308229, discontinued just after 1900.) You are lucky it casts so large; you can re-size it as needed (takes a #460 top punch) for any of the .45 handguns, and should make a nice plinker for the .45-70 and up rifles, with the hollow base obturating to fit any of the oversize bores.(This was a chance to exercise the indexes I am working up of Lyman/Ideal bullets, top punches, etc.)floodgate1

---

You prolly already know this but I found yet another number for this same boolit. It is in the Lyman 45 edition pg 263 of pistal bullets. It is the first one listed in 45 cal and is #45468. The man that had these moulds liked 45 cal as he had most of the designes on this page. I tried another yesterday the #454424. In W/W it dropped at .456" and 256gn. Hope to shoot some of those today in the Ruger Bisley sized at .454" This is the same estate that the Herters swage set came from. I find it very conveniant for hollow pointing. You can take some very ugly castings lube them  and  then squish them into perfect square sharp boolits with the most perfect base you can make. Also with this stuff came a set of Lyman 44 cal moulds. #429215 one standerd and one hollow point. Hope to try them soon. Should make a fast boolit for the Marlin 44 mag. For the power out put to packing weight I dont think you can beat that little Marlin.

BIC/BS 

You prolly already know this but I found yet another number for this same boolit. It is in the Lyman 45 edition pg 263 of pistal bullets. It is the first one listed in 45 cal and is #45468.

Bullshop-

 The 450229 and the 45468 are different designs, not the same bullet. I've cast out of both molds and they are different. The 450229 has a deep hollow base and the 45468 has a slight hollow base, with different weights also.

Bull Shop; 45 2-1:

I'd forgotten that one!  It is a slightly different design, less of a SWC profile.  The old Ideal Handbooks listed it from at least 1897 (HB #9) through 1904 (HB #16), and Lyman revived it around 1927 after they took over Ideal (HB #28); they dropped it again in 1984.  If it's a "loose block" mould it's a Lyman-made one; if fixed-block, an old Ideal.

Handbook #9 says, "This is the same as #45467 [RN FB 200 gr.],, except that it is made lighter [185 grs.] by having flat point [since it had to be made as a nose-pour] and hollow base."  Both were designed for the .45 "Long" Colt.

Those old HB's make some real interesting reading, and I learn something new every time I look at one!  I just hope i'm not boring you-all with these details.

floodgate1

3/24/05 Played hooky

Thats right just as BS Mom had them all busy with school lessons I said boys lets go huntin!!! After surviving THE LOOK from BSM BSJR # 1, 2, and 3 grabed a hornet and the Ruger Bisley 45 and headed to the state bison range for a long walkabout. This of cource for an official testing of the Lyman #454424 newly acquired by us in the estate buy. I can happily report it is an extreamley accurate boolit. We left behind a trail of mayhem and carnage inflicted on the winter herd of buffalo chips. BSJR#1 displayed his style and finness easily exploding the large frozen chips out to 200 yards off hand with the hornet and the NEI 45gn FNGC. BSJR#2 did almost as well but still has a bit of trouble holding for offhand at age 9. BSJR#3 encoraged to keep shooting so he could reload the brass. He just got a new press and powder measurer for his B-Day.  I had no trouble at all discintigrating the frozen black beasts with the 45 colt at about 100 yards. At about 200 hits were about equal to misses. A few details on the 45 load that shot so well. The ruger has about .454" cylender throats so I sized the boolits in a .457" die. The mould dropped them at about .456" so the die only lubed them. I had been given a couple cans of Win #540 so had worked it up to 13 gn for a good shooting moderate pressure load with this boolit. Went with CCI#300 primers as it wanted nothing to do with the 350 mag primer. It shot good at the bench at 30 yards where I test handgun loads but realy shined on the range on distant targets. All and all a good fun day at the bison range. On our return to the homestead we discovered that BS Mom apparently had guilt for hastily blasting me with THE LOOK for suggesting a plesent spring break from lessons. So overcome was she with guilt that she had baked each of us a blueberry rubarb pie to have for our dinner. Thats right pie for dinner, just grab your spoon and start right in the middle. It just doesn't get any better, PRAISE GOD !!!

BIC/BS

.................Bullshop, great post! Whatta way to spend the day. A dad and the 3 boys out with their guns and having it out with targets of opportunity. That's the way you build memories that last a life time. When they're older they'll always have that and can say, "I remember me and my brothers and your grandpa would go out with our guns .................. BTW, how in the heck do ya see a cow flop at 200 yards? Are they Day-glo orange?

I did something similar with my daughter when she was little. We lived in the country and the inlaws had some sheep up the canyon from us. My daughter Christian would get her 'My Little Ponies' day pack and we'd put in binoculars, a couple boxes of CCI Stingers and she'd add a couple fruit rollups and a juicebox or 2. She also got to carry my Buck Skinner (had to wrap the belt about twice around her!  I'd carry the canteen and my 582 Rem bolt 22RF.

An Edison powerline road wound up the hill and made a curve around a ridge just above the sheep pasture. We could lay against the berm at the edge of the road and be about 25-30 feet above the pasture. Christian would use the binoculars to spot ground squirrels ( I could easily see them myself ) but I'd wait until she'd found one that was a good shot and then I'd shoot at it. After maybe 30 minutes she'd get tired of that and we'd have to go get some big dirt clods to roll down the hillside. Then maybe hike aways further up the road and then we'd go back and shoot some more.

After we were done we had to go cut the tails off the squirrels we'd gotten. When we got home we'd staple them up to the eaves of the tack room. Donna thought that was pretty tastless but it was our answer to having deer or elk antlers up over the barn door! I think about those times often. Love those boys of yours and spend time with them while they're little. They're only little for such a short time, and then they grow up. Not that they're not your boys anymore, but it's a lot different.

I can't wait for grandkids

.....................Buckshot